The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Dessy » 11th April, 2017, 10:41 am

JonathanT88 wrote:
TheBrunswickian wrote:
Pity wrote:
TheBrunswickian wrote:I think its one of those words that was used as a derogatory that we have turned around and use as a symbol of resistance. Its like African-Americans using the n-word.


With this, I now change my stance. I don't like to see the use of the n-word by African-Americans, so I think it's fair to say that gay people shouldn't use the f-word. Using "faggot" is trashy!

But you're white... So whatever words African-Americans use in conversation with other African-Americans, it's really not your place to decide. Not that a) that stops you and b) that's not pertinent to this conversation


He's more than entitled to take a principled opposition to the re-appropriation of offensive slang if he likes, and as such his approach to other examples of the same thing is very relevant. All he's doing is attempting to reduce hypocrisy, which seems pretty admirable and which I believe we should all try to do.

Moreover, I'm generally no believer in policing or objecting to language in any case, but if you are going to do it I see no reason why you shouldn't be able to do so across racial lines. We're all human beings, and unless you're going to pretend you have any detailed understanding of the African-American experience I see no reason to avoid commenting. I don't object to the use of nigger by blacks (and don't see any reason to) but that doesn't mean there aren't reasonable arguments to be made, by anyone capable of, well, making an argument.

This is the second time you've suggested people avoid commenting on things which don't affect a group they're part of (last time it was the gender wage gap), and I'm afraid I don't really see the logic. Should all politicians seeking to improve the lives of the working class be from low-income backgrounds?


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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Dessy » 11th April, 2017, 10:43 am

Ignoring that mess. Pity can say whatever he wants on the issue. It won't change ish.
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Pity » 11th April, 2017, 11:24 am

My only point is that it sounds trashy when African-Americans use "nigga," so the use of "faggot" by gay people is just as trashy and now I won't use it anymore.
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Dessy » 11th April, 2017, 11:25 am

^this nigga...
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Pity » 11th April, 2017, 11:26 am

^this fag...
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Dessy » 11th April, 2017, 11:28 am

Trashy smh. Be classy, fellow!
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Jimjam » 11th April, 2017, 6:42 pm

JonathanT88 wrote:
Jimjam wrote:I can fucking tell you right now it does not mean sausage in Scotland :lol: :lol: :lol:


You mean you don't like to sink your teeth into a good faggot on a Sunday morning?


I'll let you know on Sunday. :awesome:
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Sturgeon » 11th April, 2017, 7:22 pm

Example wrote:lets be real no one ever uses the word for their ciggs

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I think you should be sensible enough to detect when a word is being used in the appropriate context without feeling the need to fly off the handles.

EDIT: Didn't see Vortex's previous shade, I swear. Great minds think alike.
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby TheBrunswickian » 11th April, 2017, 7:55 pm

JonathanT88 wrote:
TheBrunswickian wrote:
Pity wrote:
TheBrunswickian wrote:I think its one of those words that was used as a derogatory that we have turned around and use as a symbol of resistance. Its like African-Americans using the n-word.


With this, I now change my stance. I don't like to see the use of the n-word by African-Americans, so I think it's fair to say that gay people shouldn't use the f-word. Using "faggot" is trashy!

But you're white... So whatever words African-Americans use in conversation with other African-Americans, it's really not your place to decide. Not that a) that stops you and b) that's not pertinent to this conversation


He's more than entitled to take a principled opposition to the re-appropriation of offensive slang if he likes, and as such his approach to other examples of the same thing is very relevant. All he's doing is attempting to reduce hypocrisy, which seems pretty admirable and which I believe we should all try to do.

Moreover, I'm generally no believer in policing or objecting to language in any case, but if you are going to do it I see no reason why you shouldn't be able to do so across racial lines. We're all human beings, and unless you're going to pretend you have any detailed understanding of the African-American experience I see no reason to avoid commenting. I don't object to the use of nigger by blacks (and don't see any reason to) but that doesn't mean there aren't reasonable arguments to be made, by anyone capable of, well, making an argument.

This is the second time you've suggested people avoid commenting on things which don't affect a group they're part of (last time it was the gender wage gap), and I'm afraid I don't really see the logic. Should all politicians seeking to improve the lives of the working class be from low-income backgrounds?

Again, I didn't say he couldn't have an opinion, I said its not his place to decide. I don't have a detailed experience of what it's like to be a person of colour, I know that. And that also applies to Pity. He doesn't have that experience, so its not his place to judge. He can not like the use of the term, and I he might not want to hear it - but it is not his place as a white person to say "I don't like black people using the word in conversation with other black people". That's such bullshit frankly.

Politicians who seek to improve the lives of the working class should speak to the working class about what they need rather than telling them. THAT is my point. You don't have to be from a group to talk about their experiences and struggles. But you also haven't lived those experiences, then you cannot speak with authority about what they need. We as men shouldn't say "this is the issue of the gender pay gap" it should be "this is what women are telling us about their experience with the gender pay gap". And if you can't see the logic in that, then I don't get you
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby TheBrunswickian » 11th April, 2017, 7:56 pm

Example wrote:lets be real no one ever uses the word for their ciggs

Someone's never been to Australia
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby dewitt » 11th April, 2017, 8:49 pm

GaycrazyBoi wrote:The word in question, which won't be repeated here for reasons of not wanting to say it any more than necessary here, originally meant "a bundle of sticks". However, during the "gay purges", where LGBT people were being burned at the stake, mostly during medieval times, they became called "faggots", as that literally meant "firewood". When the gay-burnings became the gay-bashings, the name stuck almost exclusively with the LGBT community, and later exclusively with the LGBT community.


Kind of off topic, but that's inaccurate, but I had to spare you and the rest of GTF from this mistake which is thrown around by homosexuals all the time. Now to set the record straight.... the popular opinion within academia is that the word originally meant a pile of sticks, and carried this idea of like a scrapheap or pile of rubbish. It was used against women in the same way that we call people shit or trash. From there, there is dissent over whether it evolved directly into a word for a male homosexual in the 20th century (under this paradigm where homosexuality is seen as effeminate and emasculating long after the period where homosexuality was a capital offense punishable by death), or became used in the word "fag." Which in this case referred to the British tradition of "fagging" in schools, where older students would haze and often sexually abuse their younger charges. The idea that sodomites were burnt at the stake and then called faggots because of cigarettes or burning piles of sticks is an urban legend.
Last edited by dewitt on 15th April, 2017, 12:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Pity » 11th April, 2017, 9:59 pm

TheBrunswickian, please do not ever comment on any topic or discussion that does not involve visually-impaired, brunette, and homosexual white men as it is not your place to insert your opinions.

Love,
A visually-impaired, blonde, and homosexual white man.
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby TheBrunswickian » 11th April, 2017, 11:21 pm

Pity wrote:TheBrunswickian, please do not ever comment on any topic or discussion that does not involve visually-impaired, brunette, and homosexual white men as it is not your place to insert your opinions.

Love,
A visually-impaired, blonde, and homosexual white man.

sounds like outlandishly misapplied identity politics but ok
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Vortex » 14th April, 2017, 8:53 pm

Well he's kind of a dildocorn, so.
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby GeoMorrisons » 15th April, 2017, 6:05 pm

I personally couldn't care less about the use of homosexual slurs.... Although, i'm sure the reason it's used so widely is it is picked up at young ages, through perhaps media and unlike the n word, is little education about the origin of words like faggot, queer, etc. But, that could be completely unfactual and made up. I can't say i've ever been educated about oppression against LGBT people to the extent that i have about the slave trade though.

At the end of the day if someone wants to call me a fag, queer, batty boy, etc, they can, i really couldn't give a shit. the things that hurt me more is when people say "lol he'll get turned if you do that" (which i've heard many times), in situations where people were breathing in my face and tickling my back in class.... Idk why, but it made me feel uncomfortable (rightly so?). But it's mainly chavs who quite clearly won't pass their GCSE's, but feel like they're below me. Not to sound condescending.
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Paigeee » 4th September, 2017, 7:02 pm

It depends on the context that the word is being used in, but personally I don't mind if LGBTQ+ people use it, and even some of my straight friends as long as it's not being said in a way that sounds homophobic.
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby c70 » 6th September, 2017, 10:31 pm

The word itself is rooted in hate. Like so many other stereo types, I think using the f-word would only be politically "acceptable" if you, and the party you are speaking to were both gay. Additionally, stating the f-word to serve as an example of the types of bulling or homophobia we face and with intentions to educate the majority on why the f-word is not socially acceptable to be used in normal conversation is, in my opinion okay.
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Woollyhoolly » 7th September, 2017, 3:39 pm

I don't give a damn about the f word. As long as you don't mean it as an insult as in being gay is bad, i dont mind. Hell, i use it myself all the time. As to the n-word, i have literally not seen a single black person on this forum. Anyway, i don't use the n-word and i don't like being called any version of it. I don't really mind other people saying it, as long as they don't like use it excessively and or are calling me it. I don't really care what your race is either tbh.
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Legolas » 13th September, 2017, 2:14 pm

Totally agree that using the 'f word' freely will mean that people won't be able to use it to insult the lgbt community. Although I'm closeted, I swell with pride when I hear someone proudly announce that they're a faggot and show that they'll shove off any insults people might throw at them.
Also, I think the word serves as a reminder that once upon a time, it was very dangerous to be lgbt and that many people died just for being who they were; fortunately that's not so much the case these days certainly in the western world. And even though I've had to stay closeted out of fear of my family and community, I can feel grateful that the fortune of myself and other lgbt individuals is not like those who endured such a miserable fate in the past.
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Re: The "F-Word" and the LGBT Community

Unread postby Legolas » 13th September, 2017, 2:14 pm

Totally agree that using the 'f word' freely will mean that people won't be able to use it to insult the lgbt community. Although I'm closeted, I swell with pride when I hear someone proudly announce that they're a faggot and show that they'll shove off any insults people might throw at them.
Also, I think the word serves as a reminder that once upon a time, it was very dangerous to be lgbt and that many people died just for being who they were; fortunately that's not so much the case these days certainly in the western world. And even though I've had to stay closeted out of fear of my family and community, I can feel grateful that the fortune of myself and other lgbt individuals is not like those who endured such a miserable fate in the past.
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